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TopTopQuality 2,731 pts

Alexis playing centrally

Posted by TopTopQuality 12 months ago · 113 replies

Wenger has finally seen the light. Everyone says that Sanchez is playing CF but in reality he's our n10 now. Or you could also say it's a 4-4-2 with Walcott and Sanchez as the 2 strikers.

Sanchez is a creative goal scorer, and he flourishes as such. Walcott isn't creative but he's a pacey goal scorer who makes good runs. And they complement each other very well.

Ozil is now playing deeper or on wings. Nitice how he has ZERO assists as of today. I actually like Ozil playing as more of a number 8.

And it probably means we've seen the last of Giroud. Have nothing against him personally, he seems to be a top bloke. But as a footballer he's not suited to Arsenal. He should probably go somewhere like Juventus, PSG, Atletico or Bayern.

And quite possibly Ozil playing deeper and having so many other central midfielders, means that Ramsey's Arsenal career is nearing its end. And I'm ok with it.

As a CM he's useless - no discipline, always ends up in the box, he thinks he's a striker.

On wings he's better but that's not his best position.

His best position is n10, like he plays for Wales. But he won't get a game in that position at Arsenal.

113 Comments

Morleys Mesut Özil > You and your mum, chief 4,420 pts
Posted 12 months ago by Morleys

Main creative player =/= assists

Last year he was both and no-one was capable of setting anyone up consistently & literally had to bounce the ball of Giroud at times

This year we have Santi, Alexis, Mesut, Iwobi and Xhaka who are all very good at creating chances so there's less reliance on Mesut

It's like saying Suarez is the main creator at Barca even though Iniesta is still the foremost playmaker within the side other than Messi

I am very happy with the options and fluidity in our play now, if one of the aforementioned has a bad game then you know someone else can take up the mantle, this wasn't the case last season

TopTopQuality 2,731 pts
Posted 11 months ago by TopTopQuality

I think my irritation with Ozil is mainly because he played with Giroud for so long and none of them can score. It's been excruciating to watch.

Because the season before Ozil came, Cazorla was playing there and even with giroud up front, it was more enjoyable to watch.

I wish we had a run of games with the following line up:

Czech

Bellerin Kos Mustafi Nacho

Cazorla Xakha

Walcott Sanchez Iwobi

Lucas

That would be goals galore

Poom 248 pts
Posted 11 months ago by Poom

A famous saying goes "don't change a winning team" and this one seems to be doing exactly that at the moment.

TopTopQuality 2,731 pts
Posted 11 months ago by TopTopQuality

Bergkamp played before I started supporting Arsenal. So I didn't get to watch him regularly.

But I've seen his stats and youtube videos.

I don't know how people compare him to Ozil. Bergkamp was miles better than Ozil.

1) He could score 2) He had more creativity

Ix Techau Evil Mastermind 14,220 pts
Posted 11 months ago by Ix Techau

Bergkamp played before I started supporting Arsenal. So I didn't get to watch him regularly.But I've seen his stats and youtube videos.I don't know how people compare him to Ozil. Bergkamp was miles better than Ozil.1) He could score 2) He had more creativity

Bergkamp was one of the top ten best players in the history of football, and he was a forward...so the comparison is ridiculous to say the least. Mesut Ozil is a traditional #10 playmaker, Bergkamp was a versatile forward in the Dutch total football model. They are two very different players, with very different roles. Bergkamp started alongside Henry in a 4-4-2 and dropped back in a free role, whereas Ozil is a #10 in a 4-2-3-1 and drifts wide to cover space left by in-cutting wingers.

medintern 196 pts
Posted 11 months ago by medintern

Just wondering --- does Opta, or any other stat agency, look at hockey assists? Would be nice to see who unlocks the defense on the most vital pass -- it might not be the assist that scores the goal. It could be the goalkeeper finding the winger wide open deep who then crosses the ball-- the winger gets the assist, but the keeper does not get any real statistical credit for opening up the defense to allow the cross and goal.

Would be interesting to see Ozil's hockey assist numbers in addition to regular assist.

Mate Kiddleton 1,415 pts
Posted 11 months ago by Mate Kiddleton

Bergkamp played before I started supporting Arsenal. So I didn't get to watch him regularly.

You missed out on one of the best players of all time.

TopTopQuality 2,731 pts
Posted 11 months ago by TopTopQuality

They are two very different players, with very different roles. Bergkamp started alongside Henry in a 4-4-2 and dropped back in a free role, whereas Ozil is a #10 in a 4-2-3-1 and drifts wide to cover space left by in-cutting wingers.

As you said yourself, formation only matters in defense. In attack, especially at Arsenal, formation is fluid. Both Ozil and Bergkamp are supposed to be the main creators and assist providers. But Bergkamp had a superior skill set, he could also score. And had more technique. And his through balls created clea-cut chances, not setting up Welbeck to shoot from an impossible angle.

Ix Techau Evil Mastermind 14,220 pts
Posted 11 months ago by Ix Techau

As you said yourself, formation only matters in defense.

No, I said formation refers to the defensive shape. Doesn't mean that all formations become formless blobs as soon as the team has possession. The attacking shape of a team depends on the players in the system. If you have two slow defensive-minded full backs in a 4-2-3-1 your attacking shape probably still has something of a back four, but if you have two pacey attacking wing backs you're not going to see a back four in possession.

In attack, especially at Arsenal, formation is fluid.

Well no, some positions are free roles, which means they are allowed to drift across the pitch to more comfortable positions if needed. Mesut Ozil uses this freedom to drift both deep and wide. Bergkamp used his freedom to move laterally from CAM to ST. He was a creative striker, or secondary forward if you will. Ozil is not, and has never claimed to be, a striker or even a forward. He is a creator first and foremost, which is why he mostly moves around on the width instead of the depth.

Both Ozil and Bergkamp are supposed to be the main creators and assist providers.

Bergkamp wasn't supposed to be an assist provider, he was supposed to be a goalscorer. He just happened to be one of the best footballers in history so could do a bit of everything.

But Bergkamp had a superior skill set, he could also score. And had more technique. And his through balls created clea-cut chances, not setting up Welbeck to shoot from an impossible angle.

You're comparing Ozil to Bergkamp, which isn't a fair comparison for all the aforementioned reasons. Bergkamp was in a class of his own. Not even Thierry Henry can be compared to Bergkamp. No player in our history can. He was by far the best player to ever play for Arsenal, and probably always will be.

Ozil should be compared to current day CAMs. Ask yourself this: who is a better #10 on earth than Ozil today? And I mean the traditional #10 playmaker CAM role. I think you'll struggle to come up with a name.

Ix Techau Evil Mastermind 14,220 pts
Posted 11 months ago by Ix Techau

Just wondering --- does Opta, or any other stat agency, look at hockey assists?

You mean secondary assists, i.e the one who assisted the assister? I don't think they do. They have the data to figure it out though, but it's not a standalone stat. You can definitely look at every assist and see who made the pass before that. Haven't seen anyone do it, but I agree that it's an interesting and important stat.

medintern 196 pts
Posted 11 months ago by medintern

You mean secondary assists, i.e the one who assisted the assister? I don't think they do. They have the data to figure it out though, but it's not a standalone stat. You can definitely look at every assist and see who made the pass before that. Haven't seen anyone do it, but I agree that it's an interesting and important stat.

Yes. That is what I mean -- sometimes the assist is not as important as the prior pass that opened the defense up. Would be nice to see that recorded somehow.

VA10 Football God 4,805 pts
Posted 11 months ago by VA10

Assists are always important. Better way to put it is that sometimes the pre assist has a bigger value (in terms of how hard it was to pull off, how it cut the defense wide open, how hard it was to spot the run etc.) on the goal than the final pass itself. Iwobi's pass to Bellerin for Theo's goal against Chelsea for example.

TopTopQuality 2,731 pts
Posted 11 months ago by TopTopQuality

Ramsey's best position is number 10/second striker, whatever you call it. Therefore he doesn't have a long term future at Arsenal. As a central midfielder he has no discipline. And there are plenty of better options in that position. I think this is his last season at Arsenal

TopTopQuality 2,731 pts
Posted 11 months ago by TopTopQuality

Ask yourself this: who is a better #10 on earth than Ozil today? And I mean the traditional #10 playmaker CAM role. I think you'll struggle to come up with a name.

So, Messi doesn't count as a traditional #10 only because he can score? He drifts wherever he likes - deep, wide.

Besides, football is purely intertainment business and there's a bunch of #10 that I enjoy watching more than Ozil - Cazorla, David Silva, Payet last season, De Bruyne, Coutinho, even Aaron Ramsey for Wales. All I care is how enjoyable it is to watch them. You can argue that Ozil is better than them, but you can't conclusively prove it, it's only your opinion.

Ozil has his strengths, but not as an offensive player. He might be good at posession retention and taking set pieces. But he poses little direct attacking threat.

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